Leah Hadley [00:00:01]:
Welcome to Intentional Divorce Insights. I'm Leah Hadley, certified divorce financial analyst, accredited financial counselor, and the founder of Intentional Divorce Solutions. I'll be your guide through the complexities of divorce, finance, and emotional wellness. Join me as we uncover practical tips and empowering insights to help you navigate your divorce with clarity and intention. Hi there, and welcome back to Intentional Divorce Insights. It is my pleasure to welcome Liesel Darby back to the show. As many of you know, Liesel Darby works in our office. She is a divorce coach and mediator.
Leah Hadley [00:00:37]:
And it's always good to hear from Liesel. Thanks for being here with us.
Liesel Darby [00:00:40]:
Oh, thank you so much for having me again.
Leah Hadley [00:00:43]:
Absolutely. So Liesel recently wrote a really interesting blog post about kind of what you deserve, during the divorce process and what you deserve in mediation. And so we're gonna explore this topic today. I think it's a loaded a loaded word, and I'm sure Liesel has a lot to say about it. But, Lisa, what made you think about this topic specifically?
Liesel Darby [00:01:06]:
So I titled this, you deserve more than a sandwich over the sink. Because right after my divorce, I was just so I didn't have any energy to take care of myself or, you know, I I couldn't think straight. And I noticed that I was eating my "meals", over the kitchen sink. And I put that in quotations because I was literally eating, like, a handful of sunflower seeds and maybe like one of those little clementines. And then maybe later I might have like half of a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. And that was it. I might have some popcorn for dinner if I thought of it, but really I didn't have much of an appetite for a while. And it and it actually it took me months to even realize that I was doing this, first of all.
Liesel Darby [00:01:57]:
And then even once I did realize it, it took me even more time to do something about it. But eventually, I got to the point where I'm like, you know, this is this is ridiculous. This I deserve to eat something more than just a sandwich over the kitchen sink. And I actually had to make myself, at that point, say, okay. I'm gonna make something to eat that actually requires a plate or a bowl, some kind of a utensil, sit down at the table with a chair. And then when I got to feel better, I even added a place mat. That was a big step. But it really you know, it made me think about how I really was not putting the time and effort into taking care of myself like I needed to during this time.
Leah Hadley [00:02:49]:
It's such a good point. And, you know, so many of us become so incredibly emotionally overwhelmed that we just don't even have the extra capacity to think about some of the basics, because we're just in the state of complete overwhelm.
Liesel Darby [00:03:05]:
Yeah. And I talked to so many women, and we're we all find ourselves going through that phase. It's, you know, it's it's been interesting to hear about that and how, you know, we kind we really fall to the bottom of the of the bucket. And, you know, self care become it's kind of like a trite, you know, almost a cliche that we kinda throw around. Like, oh, you gotta do self care. But it really is so important during this time especially because, first of all, you're like you said, we're just we're so overwhelmed. We're just trying to keep our head above water, really. You know, there's I've I've heard so many people talk about, you know, they dread opening the mail because there might be another bill from the lawyer and it's just it's thousands of dollars.
Liesel Darby [00:03:48]:
And and and, you know, and the other thing, life doesn't stop just because we're we're having, you know, a traumatic time in our lives. You know, kids still have to go to school. Kids still have activities. You still have to go to work. You still have to pay your bills. You still have to, you know, make time if you're caring for other family members. You get the cat to the vet. I mean, all all these things.
Liesel Darby [00:04:12]:
Life doesn't stop. And when you are just feeling so discombobulated, it's really hard to even think about, when was the last time I washed my hair? I mean really it can just it can get just so overwhelming. And like I said, we always have oh self care first. But it really becomes important because during this time, you might not you may be doing the bare minimum or even below the bare minimum during this time.
Leah Hadley [00:04:43]:
That's such a good point. And why is self care so important during this time in particular?
Liesel Darby [00:04:49]:
Well, for one thing, you have to our self esteem has taken a beating during this time. I mean, I don't care if you initiated the divorce or your spouse did or whether you have been talking about this for a long time or maybe it came out of left field. But most people are not feeling at their best when they're going through this process. It's just one of these things where you can depending on the circumstance, you might feel totally worthless. I mean that's not uncommon. Like why why is this happening? I thought we, you know, we're gonna stay together forever. I you know? Or even if it was not so great, you might have been thinking, well, this is just one of those bumps in the road. We'll work through it.
Liesel Darby [00:05:30]:
Whatever. Again, it depends on your circumstance. Other people have had very, you know, they definitely know this was a long time coming or, you know, needed to happen. But for even if that's the case, you're usually not feeling like your brightest, peppiest, happiest self when you're going through this process of dividing your lives. Especially if there's kids involved, because they're you know, you're so worried about how are how's this gonna affect them? Are they gonna be okay? You know, what's family, what are friends thinking? I I know when I got divorced, everybody was shocked that we were getting divorced because we seem to be a really happy couple that got along really well for a very long time, and that was true. And so even so when this happened, when my husband had an affair and that blew everything out of the water, nobody knew. You know? They nobody knew about that. I had known it was not right for a while, but I didn't suspect that was happening.
Liesel Darby [00:06:29]:
I guess maybe I should have. But, you know, speaking just from my own experience, I did not feel very good about myself during that time. So it's just and also it also goes to, put your own oxygen mask on first. Again, that's one of these things that we kind of throw around a while. But it is so true. If you are not taking care of yourself, you don't have anything to give to your taking care of your kids or you know your work. I know so many people have told me that their work just really suffered during this time. In fact one of my really good friends told me she was so happy that she had worked for a while in her place of work because so they knew her level, you know, what she was capable of.
Liesel Darby [00:07:12]:
Because she said for the first year after her divorce, she just wasn't hitting her marks. And she's a brilliant person. And I think it was about a year later her supervisor told her even like, you know it's a good thing that we knew what your normal standard was and what the situation you were going through because you really let the ball drop in in many cases. And they gave her grace for that. Some companies may not be so willing to do that or they might not even know what you're going through in order to to give you some grace during that period. But anyway but you really have to be able to at least, you know, feed your body right. Right? If you're not if you're only eating junk food or if you're not eating hardly anything like I was, and maybe you're you're so focused on, like, you just gotta feed the kids. I just gotta get a pizza in them tonight.
Liesel Darby [00:08:05]:
You're not thinking about anything green. You're not thinking about putting together some kind of a balanced meal plan, and then you're like, I'll just eat the scraps of whatever they don't eat. Or I'll just grab a cup of yogurt or something. It's it's gonna do more wear and tear on your body anyway. Sleep Good point. Is so important too. I think you really underestimate that. And that's one of the first things to go when you're going through this process and you're just so worried.
Liesel Darby [00:08:33]:
You are worried about everything. And people that I know, I laid in bed nights. I was still awake at three 3AM. It's hard to function. Your brain cannot function when you don't get enough sleep. You know, so it's it's basically just being able to function. And especially because you're going through this period of your life when you're making big decisions about financial things, you know, that are gonna have a big impact down the road, you can't be doing that on two hours of sleep a night and think you're gonna be making really good decisions.
Leah Hadley [00:09:08]:
Sure. Absolutely. What are some other ways that people can take care of themselves during a divorce? I know for me, I implemented a, gratitude practice that really helped me with my mindset when I was going through my divorce, which is tremendously beneficial. I really do that. I think anytime I'm going through a very difficult time, I find that really focusing on what I'm grateful for, can really help shift my mindset. But what are some other ways people can take care of themselves during divorce?
Liesel Darby [00:09:39]:
Well, first of all, let me just say I love that, and I do think that's so helpful. Just as a reminder that even though things seem all doom and gloom at the time, that you can still every day find something that went right or that you really appreciate. A little bit to piggyback on that a little bit, I started doing something just within the last year called. I'm looking for something to surprise and delight me every day. And that might for some people that might be a stretch when especially maybe when you're you're not feeling so great. But just just try it and see if if something, anything can surprise and delight you. It could be just a song you hear on the radio that you haven't heard in years. You know? Or your or your kid came up and gave you just a kiss from out of nowhere.
Liesel Darby [00:10:23]:
That's surprising and delightful. It doesn't have to be anything big. But just to change your focus a little bit. I understand you might not feel like even entertaining that thought, but it's it might be worth just just trying and see what happens. But other things, just simple things. Put on some lipstick and some mascara. Just because at least then you know that you can face the day. You know the power of lipstick is really underrated.
Liesel Darby [00:10:51]:
And I'm not talking about you have to put on a big bold red lip, but just something that it's a really positive signal to yourself like I matter and I care what I look like right now. Because I'm telling you, there were there were times when I had to count. When was when's the last time I took a shower? When did I wash my hair? And just to start that to reverse that process. Right? To just make sure that yeah. Okay. I know I took a shower last night. Hallelujah. I can go out to the grocery store today and I didn't feel like I have to hide.
Liesel Darby [00:11:27]:
Just put some lipstick on. It will make you feel better. Another thing that, like, I had to do is I started during this time, I only wanted to wear sweats. Like I just did not want to put on any kind of real clothes. But again, it's it's a psychological thing as well as a physical thing. Put on some clothes that have some snaps, zippers, buttons, You know something that has some structure to it. You will feel better. It's just it's just a thing.
Liesel Darby [00:11:56]:
You will feel better. And take that a step back further. If you've been living in your pajamas, get out of your pajamas and put something else on. And tell yourself, you know what, I can have a pajama day on Sunday or whatever it is when you can allow yourself just to have that total relaxation. But if you're going to go out in public and even if you're not, if you're like a stay at home mom or whatever, you still have to go out and get groceries. You still have to go out and get gas in your car. Put some real clothes on. Again, it's a it's a lot of psychological benefit just because you're telling yourself I matter and, you know, and and I I can do this.
Liesel Darby [00:12:35]:
Going back to the the meal thing, make yourself a nice dinner. Doesn't have to be anything fancy. But at least something that would entail turning on the oven or the burners. I mean I don't even care if you're just making some soup and a grilled cheese sandwich. Just again, you're telling yourself I matter and I deserve to be taken care of, and I'm going to take care of myself. And even better, maybe you work yourself up to, you know, make something in the crock pot that's more than you know, that you can share with somebody. Invite a friend over, have her bring the wine. Just something again to make tell yourself that I do matter.
Liesel Darby [00:13:14]:
Look I have friends. Somebody else cares about me. Okay. This is this is good. We can we can share a nice meal. We can we can raise a glass and toast to our freedom. Or just to, hey today I made it through the day and I'm glad you're here. Whatever it is, That's a that's a nice thing to do.
Liesel Darby [00:13:32]:
Another big thing going back to self care is move your body in some way. Get some exercise. I don't care if it's just a walk. Walking was really therapeutic for me during this time. I I I, figured out it was like a three mile walk around my neighborhood. And so I would walk, depending on my stress level, anywhere from three to 12 miles a day. 12 miles didn't come up very often. Thank heavens.
Liesel Darby [00:14:00]:
It was when I was really stressed and I didn't do it all at once. You know, it might be something like, if I would go around once and I was still really in my head about something, I would go around again. So and then depending on what happened later in the day, I might go around again. I wore holes in my Skechers. I walked so much.
Leah Hadley [00:14:21]:
My goodness.
Liesel Darby [00:14:22]:
I did. I wore I went through two pairs of Skechers during, like, a four month period. But it was it was just good to get out of the house, a. It was good to get some fresh air. It was good to see some grass and trees. Here's some birds. Sometimes I even stopped and talked to a neighbor. So that was good too.
Liesel Darby [00:14:45]:
And it also helped me sleep. Like sometimes I just needed to wear myself out so that I could get some sleep.
Leah Hadley [00:14:53]:
Yeah. I have started doing kickboxing a few months ago, and I find that on the days that I do kickboxing, I sleep so much better. Yeah. It's getting all that energy out. You know?
Liesel Darby [00:15:07]:
It is. And, you know, move movement is so important because it does help you get, your feelings out. It does help to move your emotions out so you're not carrying them around in your head all the time. I wanna circle back around to your gratitude journal, because that's another thing to do in order to get some good sleep is just get the thoughts out of your head. And it it doesn't have to be the gratitude part, but that's really important too. Anything you're worried about, write it down so that it's not in your head anymore. It's actually out onto something else. That will help you to be able to go to sleep too to release it.
Liesel Darby [00:15:42]:
But the gratitude journal right before bed is really good because it puts you in a nice state of mind of positive things. Right? If that's the last thing you're thinking about before you go to sleep, but you know, this went well today. I'm so happy. I have a, you know, my my kids were really good today. I had a good cup of coffee. I made it to work on time. I was able to get into these jeans that I haven't tried on in years. I took a good walk.
Liesel Darby [00:16:08]:
I talked to a good friend today. Anything. Write it down because now you're in a very different state of mind than if you're fretting about bills or you know what's your next move, with in your divorce, whatever. And you can't
Leah Hadley [00:16:21]:
The thing that I found when I was doing the gratitude practice very consistently is it changes not just your mindset when you're doing the practice, but then you are all day looking for things that you wanna include, which is really cool because then it's just you're really focused on on that gratitude piece, which is nice. Yeah.
Liesel Darby [00:16:41]:
It changes your filter. I talk about this with my clients a lot is, you know, we all we and you can choose your filter. That's the nice thing too. So you notice people who are very gloom and doom, they're looking for things that reinforce that. And so that's what they find. When you switch over to being wanting gratitude, what's going good? What am I grateful for? What do I appreciate? What surprises and delights me? You will find you are looking for those things and you will find them. Right. It really is kind of a magical thing.
Liesel Darby [00:17:11]:
It's it's really cool. Anybody can do this. And give it enough time and you will start to see that many many more good things are out there than you know, the the bad things that you're kind of feeling overwhelmed with. It's such a nice counterbalance to that. Let's see. What else? Plan something intentionally in your day to look forward to. I think that's really important. And again anybody can do this.
Liesel Darby [00:17:37]:
And you know whether you say okay, I'm gonna plan a nice dinner. Let's tie it all up. Right? Gonna plan a nice dinner tonight. I have the ingredients. I know what I'm gonna do. I'm gonna invite this person over. I'm really looking forward to this. Or, a phone call maybe with a friend you haven't talked to in a while.
Liesel Darby [00:17:57]:
Or have a walk to look forward to. Even better if it's with a friend. Right? And you have, you know, you something on Netflix that you wanna, you know, you wanna watch. Have something planned so you have something to look forward to. That's really, really helpful too in helping you to get through a tough day. So just having something like that. And let's, I think let me see if there's anything else. Oh, and Daydream.
Liesel Darby [00:18:27]:
This is another thing I think you can do. Again, it's free. Anybody can do this. Let yourself just kinda stare off into space for a little bit, or if you wanna journal or however you wanna do this. But just kinda let your mind go to a happier place. Think about how you want your life to look on the other side of this. And then another nice thing to do is anything you can do to bring that daydream into your reality, even if it's just a tiny piece of it, go ahead and start doing that. So maybe it's like, you know, you really wanna go on a nice vacation to the beach, you know, after your divorce is final just as a reward for yourself.
Liesel Darby [00:19:16]:
You can still go right now, you can start looking at things online, nice beach destinations. You can listen to some beach boys. Yeah. You can, you know, maybe start daydreaming about a bathing suit you wanna be able to to get in and, you know, whatever you can do to kind of bring that vision a little bit more into your own reality at this time is helpful. And it's fun. This is supposed to be a fun thing. A little bit of relief maybe from the, you know, what's going on around you. And the other thing is when you're dating about these things, you actually can make them come true.
Liesel Darby [00:19:57]:
And I think it's really good to be reminded that you do have some power over things, even during this time when it might seem like you there's a lot out of your control.
Leah Hadley [00:20:10]:
So in addition to the divorce coaching, I know you also do quite a bit of mediation. And I think that the word deserve is very challenging when it comes to mediation. Right? Everybody wants to who enters mediation, they always say they want a fair settlement. But as we know, the fair is in the eye of the beholder. Mhmm. What does a person deserve during the mediation process?
Liesel Darby [00:20:35]:
Okay. So just these are some basic things. You deserve to be treated with respect and civility by your spouse during this process. So you know you should be able to at least talk to each other in a way that you're not calling each other names, you're not nobody is blowing their stack on things. Treating this as a business meeting and behaving in a way that shows mutual respect and the ability to listen to each other and take the other person's point of view into consideration as you're making your agreements. So that's the first thing. You deserve transparency in the whole process. And that's from everything from, you know, any kind of ring communication emails to each other, to the mediator, it needs to be cc'd to everybody else too.
Liesel Darby [00:21:30]:
So that there's no, you know, there's not even a whiff of the mediator being on one person's side or the other. And you also need you deserve to have transparency in all the financial records. You know, you need to have transparency in everything that's going on so that you know what you come to the mediation table with. So no hiding records. No, you know, well, I don't wanna let you know exactly what I earned last year. I don't want you to know, you know, what's in this bank account over here. You deserve to know, have transparency in all of the financials, during the mediation process.
Leah Hadley [00:22:09]:
And I even encourage people, if you're not getting transparency around the financials, that you may need to actually work through the court to get that information. That the information is absolutely information that you're entitled to see and know in making informed decisions. And while we are obviously big proponents of mediation here, sometimes we can't get enough information in order for people to make decisions during mediation, and that's just being realistic.
Liesel Darby [00:22:36]:
That is being realistic. And also I always tell clients, you know, maybe have a session with you. Right? To sit down with them or maybe both of them to get a clear picture of their finances, what maybe things might be valued at or, you know, best case scenarios. So they know what they come to with, you know, at the mediation process. So they have some things they can move around or they can take into consideration. And, you know, the nice thing about mediation is it's not by the law, you know, per se. They have the ability to make deals, to make packages for each other as long as it's fair. Right? Mhmm.
Liesel Darby [00:23:17]:
Absolutely. But that requires being able to know what your numbers are. And then the last thing two things. You deserve to have your voice heard. So mediation is not about one person coming in and making demands and, you know, the other person can't, you know, can't say what they want. You deserve to have your voice heard. You have the chance to always, have it. You can talk.
Liesel Darby [00:23:44]:
That's why we're here. I want I want my clients to be having conversations with each other and that's my job is to facilitate that. So, you know, if if I notice that maybe one person is a little more overbearing or, you know, takes most of the time, I make sure to allow the other person an equal amount of time to to say what they need to say too. So you really do deserve to have your voice heard. And the last thing I have is you deserve to make decisions about your life. So I mean, it's your life. That is the nice thing about mediation is the control is in your hands. It's not a judge who doesn't know your family, doesn't know your kids, doesn't know you.
Liesel Darby [00:24:28]:
Making life decisions, you know, make handing down the judgments that you have to abide to after your divorce. You deserve to making these decisions for yourself. That's why I'm such a proponent of at least trying mediation first. Anything you can get done in mediation is better than, you know, just having a judge say. Unless of course, like we always say, there are some certain situations where, maybe you do need to be in a court and have a judge rule because it might be the more fair thing that comes out of it. But try mediation first. See see what you can get done there before you, think you have to go to the courts to have them make decisions for you.
Leah Hadley [00:25:09]:
It's such a good point because so often people feel like if everything is not resolved in mediation, mediation has not been successful. But in reality, I mean, you can resolve a lot of the different issues. Even if it's 50% of the issues that get resolved, that can still save you a significant amount of time and money, real figuring that piece. The rest, you know, the rest is then one year. It's just gonna cost more because mediation is just a process that reduces those expenses, get you in the room together, get you working together toward resolution. So it's it's an important point that you don't have to sell everything in mediation for mediation to be successful for sure.
Liesel Darby [00:25:53]:
Right.
Leah Hadley [00:25:54]:
Now, Liesel has a great list of journal prompts that she developed that we will include a link to in the show notes. Okay. So if you are looking for ways to really care for yourself during the divorce process, I think that's a fantastic resource for folks. We'll also include a link to, schedule an appointment with her. So if divorce coaching or mediation is something that you are interested in, you can certainly reach out to Liesel and talk more about those options that are maybe sort of outside the traditional realm, but can really, again, save people quite a bit of time, money, and just like the emotional drag of, going the more traditional route.
Liesel Darby [00:26:33]:
Yeah. And just remember, you don't have to do this alone. It's nice to have somebody, I'm speaking now as a coach. A lot of people don't even know what a divorce coach is. But really, it's about having somebody who you can bounce your ideas off of. I am an alternative dispute resolution certified divorce coach. So I can help with keeping conflict to a minimum and helping you to work through conflict with your other with your spouse in a productive way.
Liesel Darby [00:27:05]:
We do a lot of visioning about what do you want things to look like on the other side and how do you make that a reality. I can help you with propositions during mediation and, you know, parenting things. There's all kinds of things you can explore in divorce coaching that can help you even if you're not using me specifically as your divorce mediator. So there's lots of stuff. I'd love to help.
Leah Hadley [00:27:30]:
Awesome. Thank you so much for being with us, Liesel. And for our audience, we will see you next week. Thank you for joining me on Intentional Divorce Insights. It's a privilege to share this time with you. I hope each episode offers valuable guidance to navigate your journey. If you find our content helpful, please leave a review to help others discover the benefits of intentional decision making in divorce. Until next time, take care and continue to embrace your path with intention.
